Battery charging question

[erict]

This is my first cart and it's going to be a learning curve as I go. I have the charger connected for around 3.5 hours and just went out to check things and I can hear the batteries making a gurgling noise which I think would be normal when charging and just want to make sure.

[dougmcp]

Your charger could take up to 16 hours, be patient.
The gurgling noise is the batteries off gassing and is normal.
Try not to unplug the charger until it finishes on it's own.
Check the battery levels after charging is complete, only use distilled water and only fill to 1/4"-1/2" above the plates.
Why not check the battery voltages while it's charging and post up the numbers while you're waiting.

[erict]

Your charger could take up to 16 hours, be patient.
The gurgling noise is the batteries off gassing and is normal.
Try not to unplug the charger until it finishes on it's own.
Check the battery levels after charging is complete, only use distilled water and only fill to 1/4"-1/2" above the plates.
Why not check the battery voltages while it's charging and post up the numbers while you're waiting.

14.5 This battery received a long charge with a regular charger.
13.9
13.3
13.5

Total volts 55.6


Is it safe to leave the charger plugged in when I am gone for 4-5 hours?

[dougmcp]

I changed your terminology above to read volts instead of amps. I know that's what you meant.
It is safe to leave it plugged in while you're gone, make sure there is ventilation. If it's in the garage, leave a door(s)/window(s) cracked.

14.5v is 2.42 volts per cell
13.9v is 2.32 volts per cell
13.3v is 2.22 volts per cell
13.5v is 2.25 volts per cell

They all will go to about 2.5v-2.7v per cell before the charger shuts off.
That is 15.0v-16.2v per battery or 60.0v-64.8v for the pack.

[erict]

I changed your terminology above to read volts instead of amps. I know that's what you meant.
It is safe to leave it plugged in while you're gone, make sure there is ventilation. If it's in the garage, leave a door(s)/window(s) cracked.

14.5v is 2.42 volts per cell
13.9v is 2.32 volts per cell
13.3v is 2.22 volts per cell
13.5v is 2.25 volts per cell

They all will go to about 2.5v-2.7v per cell before the charger shuts off.
That is 15.0v-16.2v per battery or 60.0v-64.8v for the pack.

Thanks Doug How do I know when the charger shuts off? Will it show 0 amps on the meter?

[erict]

Charger was shut off when I got home tonight. Not sure how long it was off but here are the readings. This is (4) 12v batteries.

12.4
12.4
12.5
12.6

Total volts is 50.4

I plan on taking the caps off in the morning and checking the water and will turn the charger back on. Then I will wait and take a reading again. I did buy a hydro tester and will perform this as well.

[Michael Eddie]

Charger was shut off when I got home tonight. Not sure how long it was off but here are the readings. This is (4) 12v batteries.

12.4
12.4
12.5
12.6

Total volts is 50.4

I plan on taking the caps off in the morning and checking the water and will turn the charger back on. Then I will wait and take a reading again. I did buy a hydro tester and will perform this as well.

If the charger was off for about a hour, the batteries will even out to around that range. Ride the cart around and see if you get a full trip out of it.

[erict]

If the charger was off for about a hour, the batteries will even out to around that range. Ride the cart around and see if you get a full trip out of it.

What would be considered a full trip?

[Michael Eddie]

What would be considered a full trip?

18 holes of golf

[erict]

18 holes of golf

I guess I have to do some driving on my property

What is a good online retailer for accessories?

[Michael Eddie]

I guess I have to do some driving on my property

What is a good online retailer for accessories?

Allthough I dont like to advertise specific companies, I can say that a Google search for "Golf Cart Accessories" brings up a list of suppliers, and the first 3 are known safe to use.

[erict]

Out of 24 cells only 5 where low. I filled just above the plates with distilled water and plugged the charger back in. The charger only stayed on for roughly 20 min. Time to drive the cart around today.

[erict]

I haven't done a hydro meter test yet but just for kicks I connected a load tester set at 200cca and two batteries say fail and two say good but recharge. Not sure if this is an accurate test or not. All batteries pass at 150cca test.


I did ride the cart for about 5 minutes and took another meter reading.

12.4
12.4
12.5
12.6

Total volts 50.0

[dougmcp]

Batteries are weak, showing around 70%-80% charged and may work for awhile if you're not going too far in it.
Drive it for a hour and see what the battery voltages are.
You can probably use the cart while you contemplate new batteries or the 6x8v conversion.
Congrats on getting it up and running.

[erict]

Batteries are weak, showing around 70%-80% charged and may work for awhile if you're not going too far in it.
Drive it for a hour and see what the battery voltages are.
You can probably use the cart while you contemplate new batteries or the 6x8v conversion.
Congrats on getting it up and running.

I will drive it around and take another reading later.


Going in I new that I was up against 6 year old batteries but one exceptionally clean cart. I will see if he will at least pay half for a new set of batteries which I think would be fair.

[Michael Eddie]

I will drive it around and take another reading later.


Going in I new that I was up against 6 year old batteries but one exceptionally clean cart. I will see if he will at least pay half for a new set of batteries which I think would be fair.

That would be nice of him, but not probable since he sold it "as is" I assume

[erict]

That would be nice of him, but not probable since he sold it "as is" I assume

He said test the batteries at home since I would be able to give them a good full charge. If there is an issue with any of them he will work with me on new ones. I feel since I was buying a cart with six year old batteries I might have an issue and knew this going in but at the same time he doesn't want to leave with the cost of new ones. We will see what he says tomorrow. This is the owner of the company I work for.

[Michael Eddie]

erict, I would seriously consider Doug's advice with the conversion, if you plan on having the cart for many years it will make a difference.

[erict]

erict, I would seriously consider Doug's advice with the conversion, if you plan on having the cart for many years it will make a difference.

Would the difference just be run time?

[dougmcp]

Would the difference just be run time?

There is a reason Club Car changed from the 4x12v set up to the new 6x8v configuration, customer and golf course complaints were extremely high. Golf courses normally lease their carts and when they don't get the full 4 to 5 years out of them they scream pretty loud and start switching brands. Obviously CC couldn't let that happen so they changed back to the tried and true 6x8v set up.
There is a lot going on with a 4x12v to 6x8v conversion. The kit comes with a new upgraded (new software) OBC which controls the charging system for the cart.
Not only do you get longer run time but you also get longer battery life expectancy (average 6 years vs 3 years) which, if the battery costs were the same, it would make you battery costs 1/2 of your existing set up.
Example:
4x12v cost $800.00 / 3 years = $266.00 per year
6x8v cost $600.00 / 6 years = $100.00 per year

[erict]

There is a reason Club Car changed from the 4x12v set up to the new 6x8v configuration, customer and golf course complaints were extremely high. Golf courses normally lease their carts and when they don't get the full 4 to 5 years out of them they scream pretty loud and start switching brands. Obviously CC couldn't let that happen so they changed back to the tried and true 6x8v set up.
There is a lot going on with a 4x12v to 6x8v conversion. The kit comes with a new upgraded (new software) OBC which controls the charging system for the cart.
Not only do you get longer run time but you also get longer battery life expectancy (average 6 years vs 3 years) which, if the battery costs were the same, it would make you battery costs 1/2 of your existing set up.
Example:
4x12v cost $800.00 / 3 years = $266.00 per year
6x8v cost $600.00 / 6 years = $100.00 per year

Doug thanks for the input. As it stands now, it will cost me $675 for (4) 12v US batteries. Changing over to the 8v would be a good move but also it would run around $950 with the conversion kit. My wife my not go for the additional cost and will be an alot easier sell of $338 to her for two 12v if my owner pays half.

[dougmcp]

Doug thanks for the input. As it stands now, it will cost me $675 for (4) 12v US batteries. Changing over to the 8v would be a good move but also it would run around $950 with the conversion kit. My wife my not go for the additional cost and will be an alot easier sell of $338 to her for two 12v if my owner pays half.

No problem, I'd have to think long and hard before I pulled the trigger on a $950 investment as well. My only goal here is to present as much information as I can so that you can make the most informed decision.
I also understand if the wife's not happy, nobody's happy.

[erict]

Just an update. He will pay half for new batteries and that is very fair to me Since my wife will not allow the additional cost of the 8v upgrade I will just have to stick with the current (4) 12v setup.

[dougmcp]

Just an update. He will pay half for new batteries and that is very fair to me Since my wife will not allow the additional cost of the 8v upgrade I will just have to stick with the current (4) 12v setup.

I'd call that Win-Win, congrats!

[erict]

I will be replacing my batteries next week in my 2005 CC Pres, 48v (4 12v). Is there a pacific procedure on doing this? I know that anytime I lift the seat I always put the switch in tow but wanted to know if the cables should be disconnected and reconnected in a particular order. Just want to be safe and not fry anything, thanks.


Also would it be any advantage changing my cables to bigger ones or would it be a waste since I will not be doing any modifications in the near future. Not sure what the stock cable size is though?

[dougmcp]

IMO you don't need to upgrade your cables at this time.

Here's what I would do:

1. Take a photo of your existing wiring for reference.
2. Place run/tow switch in tow.
3. Remove batteries and clean/paint the battery frame.
4. Install new batteries, make sure the polarity location is the same as the ones you removed.
5. Clean your existing cables and reinstall.
6. Check the pack voltage with a meter (50v +/-)to make sure they are wired correctly.
7. Spray terminal protectant on battery posts.
8. Place the run/tow switch in run.
9. Test drive the cart (short).
10. Recharge batteries.

[erict]

IMO you don't need to upgrade your cables at this time.

Here's what I would do:

1. Take a photo of your existing wiring for reference.
2. Place run/tow switch in tow.
3. Remove batteries and clean/paint the battery frame.
4. Install new batteries, make sure the polarity location is the same as the ones you removed.
5. Clean your existing cables and reinstall.
6. Check the pack voltage with a meter (50v +/-)to make sure they are wired correctly.
7. Spray terminal protectant on battery posts.
8. Place the run/tow switch in run.
9. Test drive the cart (short).
10. Recharge batteries.

Good idea about taking a pic. Thanks Doug

[erict]

Just was thinking if I should wait until spring for new batteries. I will be storing it away at the end of October and wonder if I install new batteries now, will that harm them since they wont see too many charge cycles for break in, thoughts?

[Michael Eddie]

Just was thinking if I should wait until spring for new batteries. I will be storing it away at the end of October and wonder if I install new batteries now, will that harm them since they wont see too many charge cycles for break in, thoughts?

Lead acid batteries do not break in, don't let Doug see you asked that

You do need to keep them fully charged every 30 days at least.

[erict]

Lead acid batteries do not break in, don't let Doug see you asked that

You do need to keep them fully charged every 30 days at least.

What I mean is the cycling of new batteries to bring them to reach their peak performance, #2 in the link. Also, can someone explain or have a pic of the correct level the water should be at when filling the battery, #6 in the link? When the say fill well, is this what the cap/s press into? If so, then I gather the water should be 1/4 below this area, hole?

http://www.usbattery.com/usb_care_maint.html

[Michael Eddie]

What I mean is the cycling of new batteries to bring them to reach their peak performance

I know exactly what you mean, and that is not how lead acid batteries work. They are at their peak performance from day 1, and will be as long as you recharge them immediately after any pedal use, and keep them fully charged while at rest and in storage. There is no memory with lead acid batteries.

[Michael Eddie]

#2 in the link. Also, can someone explain or have a pic of the correct level the water should be at when filling the battery, #6 in the link? When the say fill well, is this what the cap/s press into? If so, then I gather the water should be 1/4 below this area, hole?

http://www.usbattery.com/usb_care_maint.html

#6 in that article basically states:

Do not recharge batteries when distilled water is BELOW the plates. If you happen to see, at any time, that the water is below the plates, refill it immediately. The correct water level for a fully charged battery is about 1/8 inches above the plates, or a quarter inch below the fill hole. Use distilled water only.

[erict]

I know exactly what you mean, and that is not how lead acid batteries work. They are at their peak performance from day 1, and will be as long as you recharge them immediately after any pedal use, and keep them fully charged while at rest and in storage. There is no memory with lead acid batteries.

So basically that info is just a myth? I just want to make sure I handle the new batteries the correct way and get the most out of them. Don't want to do a newbie mistake

[erict]

#6 in that article basically states:

Do not recharge batteries when distilled water is BELOW the plates. If you happen to see, at any time, that the water is below the plates, refill it immediately. The correct water level is about 1/8 inches above the plates, or a quarter inch below the fill hole. Use distilled water only.

Is there a measuring stick of some sort to make the level easier to achieve?

[Michael Eddie]

So basically that info is just a myth? I just want to make sure I handle the new batteries the correct way and get the most out of them. Don't want to do a newbie mistake

Yes to lead acid golf cart batteries. But not a myth to your cellphone battery or any NiCd battery, these are 2 very different types of batteries.

[Michael Eddie]

Is there a measuring stick of some sort to make the level easier to achieve?

Check this thread out http://www.golfcartsforum.com/club-c...batteries.html

[erict]

Check this thread out http://www.golfcartsforum.com/club-c...batteries.html

I ran across that thread last week Matti. I am thinking about getting them. Thanks

[erict]

So it would be fine for me to get new batteries now even though I will be storing my cart away at the end of October? I will be connecting the charger every month during the winter months. Just want to make sure this is just fine and I wont shorten the life of the new batteries and it becomes an expensive lessen learned

[dougmcp]

If you are putting your cart away in another month and the cart is working OK, I would stall off the purchase of new batteries until the spring.
Regardless of cycles, batteries do deteriorate with age.
Normally batteries have a 12 month replacement warranty and to me it would be advantageous to start the warranty period in the spring and not use up 1/2 of your free replacement warranty while the cart is just sitting.

The break in of new deep cycle batteries is required and they need to be recharged before driving them. Most people don't do this but in a perfect world it should be done.
Starting batteries for your car are 100% out of the box but deep cycle batteries are slightly different because of the lead thickness on the plates and they need to be conditioned. They do take an amount of time to condition themselves, from new they are only about 90% and with recharging they eventually come up to full. Within 10-20 cycles they will be at about 95% and the rest is slow building and could take up to 50 recharges to get right to their peak.
Here is a little info from Trojan, see item 6: http://www.trojanbattery.com/pdf/TRJ...UsersGuide.pdf